Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

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Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby StevieDS » Fri Jun 24, 2016 14:00

This is based on one of Jamil's recipes, most of which have been very good but this is a style I know nothing about so any comments are welcome.

Biere de Garde

Recipe Specs
----------------
Batch Size (L): 20
Total Grain (kg): 6.90
Total Hops (g): 25
Original Gravity (OG): 1.075
Final Gravity (FG): 1.010
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 8.5 %
Colour (SRM): 7
Bitterness (IBU): 26
Boil Time (Minutes): 90

Grain Bill
----------------
4.800 kg Pilsner (70%)
1.300 kg Munich I (19%)
0.350 kg Caravienna (5%)
0.450 kg Granulated Sugar (6%)

Hop Bill
----------------
25 g Northern Brewer Pellet (9.8% AA) @ 90 Minutes (Boil)

Water Profile
----------------
Calcium - 108ppm
Sulphate - 66ppm
Chloride – 136ppm
Bicarb – 42 ppm

Notes
----------------
Single step Infusion at 64°C for 90 Minutes.
Fermented at 18°C with WLP011 - European Ale
Pitch at 19°c raise temp by 0.5°/day up to 21°c.

"The master has failed more times than the beginner has even tried."

Planning: Brett Amarillo Smash
Fermenting: AG52 Brett Saison v2, AG41 Lambic v2.0
Conditioning: AG51 Brett Saison, AG48 Biere de Garde, AG42 Westvleteren XII Clone, AG29 Lambic v1.0
Drinking: AG51 Brett Saison v1, AG53 Standard Bitter
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Re: Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby robwalker » Fri Jun 24, 2016 14:34

Serum is your man for this I reckon! I know it's a malt focused style and you're using the proper ingredients so can't forsee any issues.
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Re: Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby StevieDS » Fri Jun 24, 2016 14:42

robwalker wrote:I know it's a malt focused style and you're using the proper ingredients so can't forsee any issues.

Good to know :thumb:
My usual suppliers don't seem to have the wlp011 yeast or the wyeast equivalent so any alternative suggestions would be good.

"The master has failed more times than the beginner has even tried."

Planning: Brett Amarillo Smash
Fermenting: AG52 Brett Saison v2, AG41 Lambic v2.0
Conditioning: AG51 Brett Saison, AG48 Biere de Garde, AG42 Westvleteren XII Clone, AG29 Lambic v1.0
Drinking: AG51 Brett Saison v1, AG53 Standard Bitter
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Re: Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby serum » Fri Jun 24, 2016 17:21

Hi stevie. Malt bill looks fine. wlp072 is out now and that's meant to be the jenlain yeast. Other than that a kolsch yeast is meant to be good. I used Wlp011 for mine and it was really nice. For hops I find brewers gold or fuggles for bittering and hallertauer or tettnang for flavour at 20 mins.

Keep the temp at the lower end of the scale and cold condition it of you've got the gear for that.

FV - Blond Biere de Garde
Bottled: Altbier, XX Bitter
Planned: Amber Saison, Spelt Saison
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Re: Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby serum » Fri Jun 24, 2016 17:23

Oh and I'd mash a bit higher, maybe 66. At 64c it came out really dry for me even with European ale which is meant to finish sweet. Sugar isn't essential.

FV - Blond Biere de Garde
Bottled: Altbier, XX Bitter
Planned: Amber Saison, Spelt Saison
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Re: Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby StevieDS » Fri Jun 24, 2016 20:35

Ok I might go for the Wyeast 2565 then. I think I have some hallertau pellets which I can chuck in too.
serum wrote:Oh and I'd mash a bit higher, maybe 66. At 64c it came out really dry for me even with European ale which is meant to finish sweet. Sugar isn't essential.

That's interesting, I thought for this style a dry finish was desirable, no?

"The master has failed more times than the beginner has even tried."

Planning: Brett Amarillo Smash
Fermenting: AG52 Brett Saison v2, AG41 Lambic v2.0
Conditioning: AG51 Brett Saison, AG48 Biere de Garde, AG42 Westvleteren XII Clone, AG29 Lambic v1.0
Drinking: AG51 Brett Saison v1, AG53 Standard Bitter
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Re: Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby serum » Fri Jun 24, 2016 21:40

Well it is but you need body too. It's quite odd in that you get a flash of malt with a fairly dry finish. It's quite a hard thing to pull off. Id like to get the hang of step mashes as I think that's how you do it. My poor man's decoction seems to do it alright where I boil a part of the wort down.

FV - Blond Biere de Garde
Bottled: Altbier, XX Bitter
Planned: Amber Saison, Spelt Saison
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Re: Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby StevieDS » Sat Jun 25, 2016 09:40

Ok so I'll up the mash temp a little then also. Good call on the reduction of first runnings, that's easy enough to do.
Have you ever tried using oats in this style to add some body, or is that a stupid idea?

"The master has failed more times than the beginner has even tried."

Planning: Brett Amarillo Smash
Fermenting: AG52 Brett Saison v2, AG41 Lambic v2.0
Conditioning: AG51 Brett Saison, AG48 Biere de Garde, AG42 Westvleteren XII Clone, AG29 Lambic v1.0
Drinking: AG51 Brett Saison v1, AG53 Standard Bitter
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Re: Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby robwalker » Sat Jun 25, 2016 10:24

They're definitely in vogue aren't they? Lol. They add silkiness and not much else - I like them in some beers where be smooth rich mouth feel is good, again couldn't comment for this style :)
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Re: Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby StevieDS » Sat Jun 25, 2016 13:06

Thanks for the replies, I almost thought this had turned into a political forum :D

"The master has failed more times than the beginner has even tried."

Planning: Brett Amarillo Smash
Fermenting: AG52 Brett Saison v2, AG41 Lambic v2.0
Conditioning: AG51 Brett Saison, AG48 Biere de Garde, AG42 Westvleteren XII Clone, AG29 Lambic v1.0
Drinking: AG51 Brett Saison v1, AG53 Standard Bitter
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StevieDS
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Posts: 618
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Location: Northern Ireland

Re: Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby serum » Sat Jun 25, 2016 17:28

I've never seen oats used in this style. Seems more of a saison thing to use different grains. Id go without to begin with and see how you like it.

FV - Blond Biere de Garde
Bottled: Altbier, XX Bitter
Planned: Amber Saison, Spelt Saison
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serum
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Re: Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby serum » Sat Jun 25, 2016 18:36

I'm not sure if it's convenient for you but farmhouse ales says the breweries do an extended boil of three hours or more which adds colour and body. I don't have time to fit that in hence my quick and dirty way of doing it but if you have more time on your hands it may be worth a bash.

FV - Blond Biere de Garde
Bottled: Altbier, XX Bitter
Planned: Amber Saison, Spelt Saison
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Re: Comments on my Bier de Garde recipe please

Postby StevieDS » Sat Jun 25, 2016 19:58

serum wrote:I'm not sure if it's convenient for you but farmhouse ales says the breweries do an extended boil of three hours or more which adds colour and body. I don't have time to fit that in hence my quick and dirty way of doing it but if you have more time on your hands it may be worth a bash.

I'm sure I could find the time to fit that in if I pick a day when the Mrs is at work!
Ok so skip the oats then. I like a nice simple recipe anyway. As for yeast, it'll probably be a couple of weeks before I order ingredients for this so I'll see what's available at the time. Thanks for the sound advice as always :hat:

"The master has failed more times than the beginner has even tried."

Planning: Brett Amarillo Smash
Fermenting: AG52 Brett Saison v2, AG41 Lambic v2.0
Conditioning: AG51 Brett Saison, AG48 Biere de Garde, AG42 Westvleteren XII Clone, AG29 Lambic v1.0
Drinking: AG51 Brett Saison v1, AG53 Standard Bitter
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Location: Northern Ireland


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