Traditional IPA

IPA, Pale Ales And Bitters, Mild, Brown Ales, Old Ale, Porter & Stouts etc

Traditional IPA

Postby rodwha » Sun Aug 23, 2015 15:45

I've only had two British IPAs, but my first was long ago when I mostly just drank American versions that are quite hoppy and more citrusy and so I didn't care for it. My last one was by Samuel Smith and I greatly enjoyed it!

I'm wanting to make something more traditional. I've read a bit of a book on the IPA, and so I'm thinking of something like Hodgson's or Burton's (Allsopp). I'm hastily looking through the book as I need to get ready to go. Hopefully you get the idea...

________________________________________
"Anyway on the wall was this sign. People who drink light beer don't really like beer. They just like to piss a lot."

"Were I to leave where else would I go? Your words of life and of truth You hold." - Third Day

"I ask not the favor given to Paul," Copernicus said, "I seek not the grace bestowed upon Peter--but I beg the mercy granted to the thief on the cross!" - Alexander Smellie 1899
User avatar
rodwha
Brewer
 
Posts: 69
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 02:35
Location: Texas, USA

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby Pjam » Sun Aug 23, 2015 15:59

I don't know why I'm giving advice, my IPA attempts haven't been spectacular, though my last effort might have been good if I'd left it on the yeast a bit longer.
I'd say keep it simple and make small adjustments if it's not right first time.

Choose from hops like Challenger, First Gold, EKG and Fuggles. And the most important part is yeast. Something like WLP002 or 005 or Nottingham.
User avatar
Pjam
Brewer
 
Posts: 1698
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2014 16:51
Location: SE London

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby mark1964 » Sun Aug 23, 2015 16:18

we cloned the greene kings ipa it was very nice. First all grain we ever did. The recipe can be found in dave lines brewing book

ITS TIME 4 ANOTHER BEER
User avatar
mark1964
Brewer
 
Posts: 2881
Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2014 19:32
Location: yorkieshire

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby rodwha » Sun Aug 23, 2015 19:13

I gave up on liquid yeasts a little over a year ago as I was moving and my yeast strains were well used at that point it's one having morphed a bit (in a good way with higher attenuation). I began using dry yeasts and about fell in love. But then all I have (dry) is S-04 by Fermentis. I've been wanting to go back with a few liquid strains and for an English strain I want an all purpose one that would work well with an ESB, IPA, northern brown, mild, and barleywine, and even better if it can also make an Irish red and Scotch ale of some sort.

I figured I'd use EKG as the hops, though I'm not against mixing various hops of English origin.

I'll eventually work up a recipe and post it for critique.

________________________________________
"Anyway on the wall was this sign. People who drink light beer don't really like beer. They just like to piss a lot."

"Were I to leave where else would I go? Your words of life and of truth You hold." - Third Day

"I ask not the favor given to Paul," Copernicus said, "I seek not the grace bestowed upon Peter--but I beg the mercy granted to the thief on the cross!" - Alexander Smellie 1899
User avatar
rodwha
Brewer
 
Posts: 69
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 02:35
Location: Texas, USA

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby Dennis King » Sun Aug 23, 2015 20:44

You may find some recipes in this book, also this blog by the same author contains a lot of background on traditional IPAs. As for yeast you can't go wrong with Whitelabs WLP002 goes well in all English beer styles.
User avatar
Dennis King
Moderator
 
Posts: 3467
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2014 17:20
Location: ESSEX.

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby robwalker » Sun Aug 23, 2015 20:51

I think most English yeasts would suit well. If you stay dry then the mangrove jacks burton ale yeast might be nice. A lot of importance in the English ipa lies in a strong malt backbone and lots of English hops.

There's a great book on the subject by the guy who wrote Hops And Glory. He brews the classic ipa and sends it on the journey too. Gotta be worth a flick!
User avatar
robwalker
Brewer
 
Posts: 3347
Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2014 18:55
Location: Longbridge, Birmingham

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby rpt » Thu Aug 27, 2015 17:07

I know this is anathema to many brewers but I think a key ingredient in an IPA is sugar. There should be high attenuation.

User avatar
rpt
Brewer
 
Posts: 1155
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2014 23:09
Location: Ilkley, West Yorkshire

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby rodwha » Thu Aug 27, 2015 20:42

Couldn't you just mash a bit lower?

________________________________________
"Anyway on the wall was this sign. People who drink light beer don't really like beer. They just like to piss a lot."

"Were I to leave where else would I go? Your words of life and of truth You hold." - Third Day

"I ask not the favor given to Paul," Copernicus said, "I seek not the grace bestowed upon Peter--but I beg the mercy granted to the thief on the cross!" - Alexander Smellie 1899
User avatar
rodwha
Brewer
 
Posts: 69
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 02:35
Location: Texas, USA

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby mark1964 » Fri Aug 28, 2015 07:16

I used black treacle and demerara sugar during the boil. Adds some great flavours

ITS TIME 4 ANOTHER BEER
User avatar
mark1964
Brewer
 
Posts: 2881
Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2014 19:32
Location: yorkieshire

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby pittsy » Fri Aug 28, 2015 07:37

rodwha wrote:Couldn't you just mash a bit lower?

You could but if you intend on a high abv then using some sugar allows the beer to be strong without too chewy much like the Belgian beers do .
User avatar
pittsy
Brewer
 
Posts: 1398
Joined: Fri Apr 04, 2014 22:43

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby graysalchemy » Fri Aug 28, 2015 09:50

I agree if you are doing a high abv beer especially something paler mash low and add a bit of sugar and also cut back on the crystal malt or use carapils instead.

Image
User avatar
graysalchemy
Moderator
 
Posts: 5643
Joined: Sat Apr 05, 2014 10:47
Location: Purgatory

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby rodwha » Fri Aug 28, 2015 13:24

Adding sugar to anything but a Belgian beer is typically looked down upon here unless it's honey. It's typically a sign of cheap and generally found in kits with the vague instructions that tell you your beer will be ready sooner than it should.

I had leftover ingredients and 1/2 a pack of dry yeast and decided to try out using brown sugar as the only means of color and flavor, as well as to brin the ABV up a bit. It actually turned out good, though a bit strange. I swear it had a slight aftertaste of brown sugar which was nice.

Hopefully this doesn't come off as sounding snobby as it's not my intent.

________________________________________
"Anyway on the wall was this sign. People who drink light beer don't really like beer. They just like to piss a lot."

"Were I to leave where else would I go? Your words of life and of truth You hold." - Third Day

"I ask not the favor given to Paul," Copernicus said, "I seek not the grace bestowed upon Peter--but I beg the mercy granted to the thief on the cross!" - Alexander Smellie 1899
User avatar
rodwha
Brewer
 
Posts: 69
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 02:35
Location: Texas, USA

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby mark1964 » Fri Aug 28, 2015 14:32

some of the big breweries still use sugar to add to their beers. If used correctly can make decent beer. I dont know where you get the idea its frowned upon. Homebrewers just like to make up the gravity without sugar with grain

ITS TIME 4 ANOTHER BEER
User avatar
mark1964
Brewer
 
Posts: 2881
Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2014 19:32
Location: yorkieshire

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby rodwha » Fri Aug 28, 2015 16:32

I'm not aware of any of the craft breweries in the U.S. that do that. I can't say much about the BMC guys but I know they use corn and rice to make up their gravity cheaply.

________________________________________
"Anyway on the wall was this sign. People who drink light beer don't really like beer. They just like to piss a lot."

"Were I to leave where else would I go? Your words of life and of truth You hold." - Third Day

"I ask not the favor given to Paul," Copernicus said, "I seek not the grace bestowed upon Peter--but I beg the mercy granted to the thief on the cross!" - Alexander Smellie 1899
User avatar
rodwha
Brewer
 
Posts: 69
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 02:35
Location: Texas, USA

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby jkp » Fri Aug 28, 2015 17:00

I don't know if you've tried it but Meantime IPA is a pretty good traditional English IPA. The Brewing Network covered it in one of their clone shows, and yes they use about 6% sugar invert. They pretty much give the recipe away in that show so it might be worth a listen.

User avatar
jkp
Brewer
 
Posts: 990
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2014 14:34
Location: China

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby LeithR » Sun Aug 30, 2015 10:58

Here's a link to Meantime, it asks for 400g sugar, I'd be inclined to make that into a number 2 invert, it will add colour and flavour.

Hop Tea - how to

Puppy Slacko 5.9.3 Linux user see HERE for details.

Searching for other planets? Why, this is the only one with beer!
User avatar
LeithR
Brewer
 
Posts: 967
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2014 06:04
Location: Kemnay, Aberdeenshire

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby Goulders » Sun Aug 30, 2015 11:24

Agreed sugar can add flavour, and apparently helps reduce nitrogen levels during the boil, which affects pH, fining and clarifying levels
User avatar
Goulders
Brewer
 
Posts: 394
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2014 21:32

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby rpt » Thu Sep 03, 2015 11:23

rodwha wrote:Adding sugar to anything but a Belgian beer is typically looked down upon here unless it's honey. It's typically a sign of cheap and generally found in kits with the vague instructions that tell you your beer will be ready sooner than it should.

There's a huge difference between using sugar as half the fermentables and adding 10% to ensure high attenuation. I'm not sure why it should be OK in Belgian beers but not in English styles especially since breweries here have used it for many years.

User avatar
rpt
Brewer
 
Posts: 1155
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2014 23:09
Location: Ilkley, West Yorkshire

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby graysalchemy » Thu Sep 03, 2015 12:00

rpt wrote:. I'm not sure why it should be OK in Belgian beers but not in English styles especially since breweries here have used it for many years.


And look what shit has been turned out here over the last 30 odd years. Sugar doesn't impart flavour well refined sugar doesn't its a flavour dilutent drying out the beer increasing alcohol and diluting the rest of the flavour. Granted unrefined sugars would add some flavours but not as much as using malt would. Remeber the reason why breweries use sugar is primarily a cost cutting exercise.

Image
User avatar
graysalchemy
Moderator
 
Posts: 5643
Joined: Sat Apr 05, 2014 10:47
Location: Purgatory

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby rpt » Thu Sep 03, 2015 12:09

Sugar has been used in English beers for far longer than the last 30 years. It may well be used to save money in some beers but it's an essential ingredient in stronger beers to stop them being cloyingly sweet. It's why it's used in Belgian ales and why it is a good ingredient to use in an English IPA.

User avatar
rpt
Brewer
 
Posts: 1155
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2014 23:09
Location: Ilkley, West Yorkshire

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby graysalchemy » Thu Sep 03, 2015 12:14

I agree with you on that as I pointed out in my first post, Though it is possible to make a beer of 9+% which isn't cloyingly sweet by just using malt, just don't use any crystal malt and mash at a lower temp. I have done it on plenty of occasions.

Image
User avatar
graysalchemy
Moderator
 
Posts: 5643
Joined: Sat Apr 05, 2014 10:47
Location: Purgatory

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby rodwha » Thu Sep 03, 2015 12:36

On this side sugar is typically used for cost, and I've only seen it used in kits. It's because of those kits, I believe, that has caused the outlook. In those kits most advise others to toss it and use what you guys call spray malt (we call it dry malt).

________________________________________
"Anyway on the wall was this sign. People who drink light beer don't really like beer. They just like to piss a lot."

"Were I to leave where else would I go? Your words of life and of truth You hold." - Third Day

"I ask not the favor given to Paul," Copernicus said, "I seek not the grace bestowed upon Peter--but I beg the mercy granted to the thief on the cross!" - Alexander Smellie 1899
User avatar
rodwha
Brewer
 
Posts: 69
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 02:35
Location: Texas, USA

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby KevinS » Thu Sep 03, 2015 13:51

rodwha wrote:On this side sugar is typically used for cost


In some cases certainly, but as Gray's, RPT and LeithR have also pointed out - it is commonly used in high ABV beers where the aim is often to produce a strong beer that also dries out to an appropriate level (so is not too sweet).

Taking american brewers for example - if you take a look at Stone - they produce 2 double IPAs (not traditional IPAs, lets be clear) that show both sides of the coin:

Enjoy By IPA - 9.4% and has a grain bill of 95% pale malt, 5% sugar
Ruinten - 10% and has a grain bill of 96% pale malt and 4% crystal (no sugar).

So as Gray's pointed out, you can absolutely make a strong beer without the use of any sugar, but the addition of sugar in a traditional english IPA is quite common.

Along with the links that Dennis sent, I would thoroughly recommend Durden Park's book. A wealth of traditional recipes gathered from historic brewing logs:
http://www.durdenparkbeer.org.uk/


For the record - when you say a traditional IPA, what do you mean exactly? Do you mean a historically accurate IPA from say 1800, or are you talking about a modern day English IPA - like Greene king?
User avatar
KevinS
Brewer
 
Posts: 391
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2014 15:51
Location: Bristol

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby rodwha » Thu Sep 03, 2015 15:50

By traditional I mean one of the first few made back in the 1800's. According to my book by Mitch Steele it was actually an October beer.

The only British IPA I've had that I liked was Samuel Smith's. I had one long ago but didn't care for it as I didn't understand they were different than what we make. I didn't appreciate it for what it is then.

________________________________________
"Anyway on the wall was this sign. People who drink light beer don't really like beer. They just like to piss a lot."

"Were I to leave where else would I go? Your words of life and of truth You hold." - Third Day

"I ask not the favor given to Paul," Copernicus said, "I seek not the grace bestowed upon Peter--but I beg the mercy granted to the thief on the cross!" - Alexander Smellie 1899
User avatar
rodwha
Brewer
 
Posts: 69
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 02:35
Location: Texas, USA

Re: Traditional IPA

Postby graysalchemy » Thu Sep 03, 2015 16:04

KevinS wrote: or are you talking about a modern day English IPA - like Greene king?


Thats got about as much in common with a traditional IPA as a pint of mild :whistle: actually its probably got more in common with a pint of mild :lol: :lol:

Image
User avatar
graysalchemy
Moderator
 
Posts: 5643
Joined: Sat Apr 05, 2014 10:47
Location: Purgatory

Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest