A simple Saison?

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A simple Saison?

Postby kohoutec » Mon Apr 03, 2017 10:23

I know this can mean a 100 different things, but...
Never tried brewing one before so not sure which direction to go in. I have an unopened 100g pack of First Gold and about 30g of EKG which i thought might work well together, although not planning on using it all in the one brew unless you lot tell me otherwise.

Was thinking about 30 IBU 5%ish, a grain bill of pilsner with a bit of Munich and wheat malt, and Wyeast 3711.

Regarding the yeast...I know this stuff can finish very dry, and that's part of a Saisons charm... Will i need some sugar in the bill as well to ensure it dries out enough or shall I just stick to the malt?

Also temperature... Assume this stuff needs to rise but how high, i have temperature control so not a problem.

And finally... Rely on the yeast for the funk or add some coriander/orange late in the boil... Thinking for this one not adding anything?

Oh, and dry hop... Yay or nay?
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Re: A simple Saison?

Postby rlemkin » Mon Apr 03, 2017 10:57

kohoutec wrote:I know this can mean a 100 different things, but...
Never tried brewing one before so not sure which direction to go in. I have an unopened 100g pack of First Gold and about 30g of EKG which i thought might work well together, although not planning on using it all in the one brew unless you lot tell me otherwise.

Was thinking about 30 IBU 5%ish, a grain bill of pilsner with a bit of Munich and wheat malt, and Wyeast 3711.

Regarding the yeast...I know this stuff can finish very dry, and that's part of a Saisons charm... Will i need some sugar in the bill as well to ensure it dries out enough or shall I just stick to the malt?

Also temperature... Assume this stuff needs to rise but how high, i have temperature control so not a problem.

And finally... Rely on the yeast for the funk or add some coriander/orange late in the boil... Thinking for this one not adding anything?

Oh, and dry hop... Yay or nay?



Sounds like you're on the right track. It's hard to go wrong and more about finding what you enjoy.

I enjoyed this article http://archive.is/VkRos#selection-685.42-685.43 and the book Farmhouse Ales is fantastic if you want to delve deeper.

I'm still gulping my way through a slightly modified version of this Rye Saison http://www.alesoftheriverwards.com/2013/06/the-farmer-in-rye-saison.html and Serum and others have some interesting looking recipes on here.

Cheers!
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Re: A simple Saison?

Postby Strongarm » Mon Apr 03, 2017 14:46

3711 is nice.

I would go pilsner/wheat, maybe 60/40. No more than about 20 IBUs. For a first go I'd forget hop flavour or additions and just let the yeast shine, as that's what the style is famous for.

In my experience no need to do anything to get a low FG, the yeast will eat through near everything regardless. Looking at my notes I got down to 1.003 with this yeast, which was 94% attenuation.

I always go warm with saison yeasts to maximise the yeast flavour, although this yeast is fairly low, relative to other saison yeasts, when it comes to temperature tolerance, with a suggested 25C max. If I was using again I'd probably pitch at 20 and hold for a couple of days then ramp up 0.5 deg a day till I was at 24C.

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Re: A simple Saison?

Postby pittsy » Mon Apr 03, 2017 16:54

I too would keep ibu lower probably 20 but I like my beers with more body so I mash either higher or step mash with a high rest to finish with an OG of around 1010 . I would also keep the ferment around 20 for a few days and raise temp 1c per day ish . The style is open to all and everything as it's just a farm beer really and it wasn't so strong back in the day either .
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Re: A simple Saison?

Postby serum » Mon Apr 03, 2017 17:55

You can do whatever you like temp wise with 3711. It will eat through it all. Sugar isn't all that necessary with that yeast but no harm in using it.

For a basic saison all you need is pilsner and if you want a simple recipe to understand what it's like then that's what I'd go for. Aim for about 6%.

I like them more bitter and normally shoot for 30-35 ibu. They're meant to he hop forward beers (by Belgian standards). Ekg is perfect for saison amd I'm sure first gold will be good in one too. I go for hops at 60 mins and 5 mins.

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Bottled: Date Saison, Rustic Saison, Spelt Saison V3, Spiced Saison, Summer Saison, Biere De Mars, Flanders Blond, Biere de Garde Ambrée, Antwerp Pale Ale, Orval Clone
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Re: A simple Saison?

Postby kohoutec » Mon Apr 03, 2017 21:29

Thanks all. This is the recipe so far but just an idea at the moment as away all weekImage

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Re: A simple Saison?

Postby serum » Tue Apr 04, 2017 06:33

Looks fine to me. Bear in mind that Munich is a base malt so 200g isn't going to do a great deal. If you really want to use it and get a bit of colour then putting a kilo in works well. Similarly if I'm putting wheat in a saison I'd shove quite a bit in too to get the flavour. Anything between a third and half the grain bill.

Again, may just be my preference but I think if you're using an ingredient you should let it shine a bit.

I'd probably still advise trying a 100% pilsner one to find your feet but another good recipe I've done a few times is 3kg pilsner, 2kg wheat and 1kg munich.

FV - Biere De Garde
Bottled: Date Saison, Rustic Saison, Spelt Saison V3, Spiced Saison, Summer Saison, Biere De Mars, Flanders Blond, Biere de Garde Ambrée, Antwerp Pale Ale, Orval Clone
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Re: A simple Saison?

Postby kohoutec » Tue Apr 04, 2017 10:11

Thanks serum I'm sure you're right. I've got those small amounts of Munich and wheat malt knocking about from a previous brew so just wanted to use them up.
But if they're not going to add much then it does seen sensible to just go 100% Pilsner so think I'll do that and just use 6kg


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