are these elderberries?

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are these elderberries?

Postby HTH1975 » Sun Sep 04, 2016 13:58

I pass a huge tree/bush everyday at the bottom of my street and noticed that they look like elderberries shown in one of my brewing books.

Are these elderberries? - want to be sure before picking them. Also discovered we have a cherry tree too (yay!).
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2016: 330L brewed (72 gallons, over 8 firkins)
2017: 105L brewed (need to update this figure)
Drinking: Landlord clone
Conditioning: ciders from 2016, hedgerow barrolo, 1914 Courage RIS (10%).
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby mark1964 » Sun Sep 04, 2016 14:09

they look like them any chance of a photo of the leaves

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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby oldbloke » Sun Sep 04, 2016 16:22

Look exactly like elderberries to me
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby ayepee » Sun Sep 04, 2016 16:36

oldbloke wrote:Look exactly like elderberries to me


+ 1 for elderberries
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby graysalchemy » Sun Sep 04, 2016 20:18

Definately elders.

Best way to get them of the stalks is to freeze them as is and then put them in a bucket and snuggle them with your hand in the bucket. The fruit breaks off but leaves a mass of stalks on the top which you can pick out.

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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby f00b4r » Sun Sep 04, 2016 23:03

I've been waiting for these to come round as I have been eyeing making a certain stout for the last year :D
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby HTH1975 » Mon Sep 05, 2016 07:22

Thanks everyone - just wanted to be sure. We have bloody loads of them round here (now that I'm aware of what they are).

I know elderberry wine is popular, but I prefer beer. Any recipe suggestions? - that elderberry stout sounds interesting.

2016: 330L brewed (72 gallons, over 8 firkins)
2017: 105L brewed (need to update this figure)
Drinking: Landlord clone
Conditioning: ciders from 2016, hedgerow barrolo, 1914 Courage RIS (10%).
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby LeithR » Mon Sep 05, 2016 08:56

E/berries have a 5 leaf configuration, you'll easily be able to tell them.

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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby graysalchemy » Mon Sep 05, 2016 09:17

This is my elderberry stout recipe
elizium Stout 2011

Date:

Gyle Number:

Fermentable Colour lb: oz Grams Ratio
Pale Malt 5 EBC 22 lbs. 5.9 oz 10150 grams 59.7%
Flaked Barley 0 EBC 1 lbs. 14.4 oz 860 grams 5.1%
Flaked Oats 0 EBC 1 lbs. 14.4 oz 860 grams 5.1%
Roasted Barley 1350 EBC 1 lbs. 0.3 oz 460 grams 2.7%
Crystal Malt 130 EBC 1 lbs. 4.3 oz 575 grams 3.4%
Brown Malt 150 EBC 1 lbs. 4.3 oz 575 grams 3.4%
Elderberry 0 EBC 7 lbs. 11.4 oz 3500 grams 20.6%


Hop Variety Type Alpha Time lb: oz grams Ratio
Bramling Cross Whole 6.3 % 90 mins 0 lbs. 6.8 oz 195 grams 100%


Final Volume: 40 Litres
Original Gravity: 1.075
Final Gravity: 1.018
Alcohol Content: 7.4% ABV
Total Liquor: 64 Litres
Mash Liquor: 42.5 Litres
Mash Efficiency: 75 %
Bitterness: 61 EBU
Colour: 156 EBC


You need to add the elderberries to the boil. The best way to do this I found was to stew the elderberries first for 10 minutes and then crush and squeeze them to extract the juice. Then add this in the last 10 minutes of the boil.

The flaked oats are just porrige oats but need toasting in a dry frying pan on on a tray in the oven to colour them up. They also require a glucan rest to get the best out of them which is very easy. On a stove in a big pan heat up some water and the oats with 10% of the oats weight in pale malt to 35c and cover and leave for 30 minutes. Then this can be heated up to stike temp and added to the main mash at the start.

This elderberry stout will require a good 12 months if not longer of conditioning.

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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby robwalker » Mon Sep 05, 2016 13:31

Careful with the cherries, some varieties are no good for you!
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby HTH1975 » Mon Sep 05, 2016 14:05

robwalker wrote:Careful with the cherries, some varieties are no good for you!


Cheers bud - might just play it safe with green-grocer cherries then

2016: 330L brewed (72 gallons, over 8 firkins)
2017: 105L brewed (need to update this figure)
Drinking: Landlord clone
Conditioning: ciders from 2016, hedgerow barrolo, 1914 Courage RIS (10%).
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby HTH1975 » Mon Sep 05, 2016 14:07

graysalchemy wrote:This is my elderberry stout recipe
elizium Stout 2011

Date:

Gyle Number:

Fermentable Colour lb: oz Grams Ratio
Pale Malt 5 EBC 22 lbs. 5.9 oz 10150 grams 59.7%
Flaked Barley 0 EBC 1 lbs. 14.4 oz 860 grams 5.1%
Flaked Oats 0 EBC 1 lbs. 14.4 oz 860 grams 5.1%
Roasted Barley 1350 EBC 1 lbs. 0.3 oz 460 grams 2.7%
Crystal Malt 130 EBC 1 lbs. 4.3 oz 575 grams 3.4%
Brown Malt 150 EBC 1 lbs. 4.3 oz 575 grams 3.4%
Elderberry 0 EBC 7 lbs. 11.4 oz 3500 grams 20.6%


Hop Variety Type Alpha Time lb: oz grams Ratio
Bramling Cross Whole 6.3 % 90 mins 0 lbs. 6.8 oz 195 grams 100%


Final Volume: 40 Litres
Original Gravity: 1.075
Final Gravity: 1.018
Alcohol Content: 7.4% ABV
Total Liquor: 64 Litres
Mash Liquor: 42.5 Litres
Mash Efficiency: 75 %
Bitterness: 61 EBU
Colour: 156 EBC


You need to add the elderberries to the boil. The best way to do this I found was to stew the elderberries first for 10 minutes and then crush and squeeze them to extract the juice. Then add this in the last 10 minutes of the boil.

The flaked oats are just porrige oats but need toasting in a dry frying pan on on a tray in the oven to colour them up. They also require a glucan rest to get the best out of them which is very easy. On a stove in a big pan heat up some water and the oats with 10% of the oats weight in pale malt to 35c and cover and leave for 30 minutes. Then this can be heated up to stike temp and added to the main mash at the start.

This elderberry stout will require a good 12 months if not longer of conditioning.


That sounds bloody gorgeous - doubt I'll be able to resist for 12 months mind.

2016: 330L brewed (72 gallons, over 8 firkins)
2017: 105L brewed (need to update this figure)
Drinking: Landlord clone
Conditioning: ciders from 2016, hedgerow barrolo, 1914 Courage RIS (10%).
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby robwalker » Mon Sep 05, 2016 15:32

Any leftover berries make an excellent cordial BTW :)
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby f00b4r » Mon Sep 05, 2016 17:13

Yep that was the stout I was referring to, it does look amazing.
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby graysalchemy » Mon Sep 05, 2016 19:42

If you have any elders left and any other fruit you could make elderberry port, my recipe for that is on herd somewhere. Again that does need to be left. I have a bottle that is 23 yes old.

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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby HTH1975 » Mon Sep 05, 2016 21:59

graysalchemy wrote:If you have any elders left and any other fruit you could make elderberry port, my recipe for that is on herd somewhere. Again that does need to be left. I have a bottle that is 23 yes old.


Port - no thanks, bleurgh!

Elderberry wine or cordial sounds good though.

2016: 330L brewed (72 gallons, over 8 firkins)
2017: 105L brewed (need to update this figure)
Drinking: Landlord clone
Conditioning: ciders from 2016, hedgerow barrolo, 1914 Courage RIS (10%).
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby Dennis King » Mon Sep 05, 2016 22:08

HTH1975 wrote:
graysalchemy wrote:If you have any elders left and any other fruit you could make elderberry port, my recipe for that is on herd somewhere. Again that does need to be left. I have a bottle that is 23 yes old.


Port - no thanks, bleurgh!

Elderberry wine or cordial sounds good though.


I have sampled GA's port and it was a lovely smooth sublime drink.
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby graysalchemy » Mon Sep 05, 2016 22:14

Elderberry port is the dogs danglies when it comes to elderberry based drinks.

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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby graysalchemy » Mon Sep 05, 2016 22:15

Dennis King wrote:
HTH1975 wrote:
graysalchemy wrote:If you have any elders left and any other fruit you could make elderberry port, my recipe for that is on herd somewhere. Again that does need to be left. I have a bottle that is 23 yes old.


Port - no thanks, bleurgh!

Elderberry wine or cordial sounds good though.


I have sampled GA's port and it was a lovely smooth sublime drink.


But you passed on the blue cheese that went with it. :whistle: :whistle:

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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby Dennis King » Mon Sep 05, 2016 22:20

graysalchemy wrote:
Dennis King wrote:
HTH1975 wrote:
graysalchemy wrote:If you have any elders left and any other fruit you could make elderberry port, my recipe for that is on herd somewhere. Again that does need to be left. I have a bottle that is 23 yes old.


Port - no thanks, bleurgh!

Elderberry wine or cordial sounds good though.


I have sampled GA's port and it was a lovely smooth sublime drink.


But you passed on the blue cheese that went with it. :whistle: :whistle:


Don't like the idea of putting anything with blue veins in my mouth.
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby HTH1975 » Tue Sep 06, 2016 11:55

I can get some lovely blue cheese from work (check out Shepherds Purse Cheeses).

2016: 330L brewed (72 gallons, over 8 firkins)
2017: 105L brewed (need to update this figure)
Drinking: Landlord clone
Conditioning: ciders from 2016, hedgerow barrolo, 1914 Courage RIS (10%).
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby graysalchemy » Tue Sep 06, 2016 12:48

oh they look good.

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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby HTH1975 » Tue Sep 06, 2016 18:52

Anyone used elderberries in secondary?

2016: 330L brewed (72 gallons, over 8 firkins)
2017: 105L brewed (need to update this figure)
Drinking: Landlord clone
Conditioning: ciders from 2016, hedgerow barrolo, 1914 Courage RIS (10%).
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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby graysalchemy » Tue Sep 06, 2016 22:36

Elders are best in the boil they are rather harsh. They are better if they ferment through and take on a more wine like flavour.

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Re: are these elderberries?

Postby HTH1975 » Wed Sep 07, 2016 11:18

graysalchemy wrote:Elders are best in the boil they are rather harsh. They are better if they ferment through and take on a more wine like flavour.


Reckon I might just do a small 10L BITB batch of this elderberry stout so I can easily age it out in demijohns for a while before bottling (unless aging in bottles is better).

Also, have you made elderberry jam? - I'm quite into making preserves at the minute.

2016: 330L brewed (72 gallons, over 8 firkins)
2017: 105L brewed (need to update this figure)
Drinking: Landlord clone
Conditioning: ciders from 2016, hedgerow barrolo, 1914 Courage RIS (10%).
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