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Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2015 16:44
by StevieDS
Today I brewed my first sour beer. When this ready I'm planning on bottling half of it and continuing to age the other half, to be blended into a geuze 3 years from now with 2 more batches.

Straight Lambic

Recipe Specs
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Batch Size (L): 20.5
Total Grain (kg): 5.000
Total Hops (g): 80.00
Original Gravity (OG): 1.048
Expected Final Gravity (FG): 1.006
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 5.6 %
Colour (SRM): 3.2 (EBC): 6.3
Bitterness (IBU): 5.4 (Rager)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 65
Boil Time (Minutes): 120

Grain Bill
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3.000 kg Pilsner (60%)
2.000 kg Flaked Wheat (40%)

Hop Bill
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80.0 g Aged Cluster Leaf (0.5% Alpha) @ 120 Minutes (Boil) (3.8 g/L)


Ferment at 20°C with US-05 for 1 week then add Wyeast 3727 Belgian Lambic Mix

Mash
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Mash in at 45°c for 15 mins
15 min rest at 55°c
45 min rest at 64°c
30 min rest at 70°c
Then raise to 76°c for mashout

My efficiency was down quite a bit on this brew, I'm usually around 75%, possibly due to the high percentage of unmalted wheat.

Also for a lambic the hops should be well aged to remove bitterness and flavour. I used hops which are a couple of years old, kept at room temperature, and there was still a fair amount of bitterness when I tasted the sample at the end :shock:

Maybe I can call it an Imperial Lambic and market it as a new style :lol:

Grain Shot
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Underletting
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1st Temp rest
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2nd Temp rest
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3rd Temp rest
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4th Temp Rest
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Sparging
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Boil going with hops just added
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Cooling
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Rehydrated US-05
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Draining into FV after cooling to 20°c
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OG hydro shot
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Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2015 17:48
by pittsy
looking good mate , I hope it turns out well sometime next year . I love the sour beers but haven't gotten round to making one ( except a cheat raspberry lager with acid malt ) they just take soooo long .
btw flaked wheat has been steamed and rolled which releases the starch ready for conversion when mashed normal .Also try using a high AA hop , this will give less harshness to the bittering . Now just the long wait . :thumb:

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2015 17:52
by robwalker
Might have been gooier than usual!

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2015 15:13
by StevieDS
pittsy wrote:btw flaked wheat has been steamed and rolled which releases the starch ready for conversion when mashed normal.

Ah ok , don't know why my efficiency was poor then. Mo big deal it'll just be a little lower abv. A lambic generally isn't too strong anyway.
robwalker wrote:Might have been gooier than usual!

No that's not it either. It was very sticky at first but after all the temp steps it was around 4 l/kg and the runoff flowed freely.

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2015 15:15
by StevieDS
24 hours after pitching half a pack of US-05 and it's formed a nice krausen.

Image

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2015 15:23
by Strongarm
Interesting. Should be within the next couple of weeks I try mine. My wheat isnt flaked, it's just unmalted. I also dont have any aged hops. Have some low AA ones though so hoping I can get maybe 40gr in whilst keeping below 10 IBUs, which I read was the threshold for the lacto and pedio to work getting it sour. Whether 40gr is enough for preserving the wort/beer I dont know.

Looking forward to Xmas 16 to hear how it tastes.

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2015 19:12
by StevieDS
As far as I know the hops don't affect the pedio, just the lacto, so if you do go over the 10 ibu limit (many debate the accuracy of this anyway) then it won't cause any issues as long as you age the beer for an appropriate time.
From what I read, pedio will do the same job as the lacto, maybe even with a little more complexity, it'll just take longer to do it, hence the need for long aging.
I was happy to read that because as mentioned above, my hops were nowhere near as debittered as I thought they were, so that'll probably inhibit the lacto.

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2015 08:28
by Strongarm
Cool. I shall be less worried about my hop usage then.

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 12:50
by StevieDS
Today I added the Wyeast lambic mix to the fv (got a serious whiff of brett funk up the nose when I opened the pack :shock: ) 7 days after adding half a pack of US-05.

Took a hydro reading, only down to 1.018 so taking it's time, as you can see there's still a thick krausen.

Now it's the waiting game...

Image

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 22:10
by Strongarm
I feel your efficiency pain, just did an attempt at a lambic with 3kg of pilsner and 2kg of unmalted wheat and the efficiency was 50% when I frequently get 80%. Not even sure the wort is strong enough at 1.040 for the style (or to lay down for 18 months), I assume the brett will eventually eat everything in there but even going to 1.002 leaves it a sub 5% beer.

Looking at it the fact I used unmalted wheat, rather than flaked, may have meant I needed to do a special mash. Oops. Will leave it and see what happens anyway.

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 19:00
by StevieDS
Had a peek at this today, about 6 weeks after pitching the sour mix and it's developing a beautiful and disgusting skin on top of the beer and there's a definite brett aroma. So far so good :cheers:

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 19:33
by pittsy
Just another 80 odd weeks left then :notworthy: hell of a wait .

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 20:38
by Pjam
Another gap in my brewing education. Think I need to try a Lambic .......... I've got to admire your work there Steve.

Why do commercial Lambic seem top have a strong fruit vibe?

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 22:46
by StevieDS
pittsy wrote:Just another 80 odd weeks left then :notworthy: hell of a wait .

Yeah I'll need to get a load more brews done to stop me being impatient with this one :shock:
Pjam wrote:Another gap in my brewing education. Think I need to try a Lambic .......... I've got to admire your work there Steve.

Why do commercial Lambic seem top have a strong fruit vibe?

It's quite difficult to find a straight lambic actually, most are fruit lambics often brewed with cherries (a good one will be made with real fruit, a poor one with fruit flavouring).

The only time I've ever had a true straight lambic was in the Cantillon brewery in Brussels and it was fantastic. It does have quite a lot of fruitiness from fermentation by-products. I find it has white wine like fruit flavours and maybe some apple and citrus. It's traditionally served uncarbonated, unlike a gueze which is a blend of old and young lambics and is very fizzy.

I hadn't much experience with sour beers before I went to Belgium but they opened up a whole new world of beer for me :drink:

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 17:04
by StevieDS
Five months after pitching and this is how it looks now.Image
As you can see the pellicle is damaged at the right side. Don't know how that happened or if it's anything to worry about.

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 17:17
by mark1964
there is a faster way of making sours ive got one fermenting now that will be ready in 4 weeks

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 17:45
by BarnsleyBrewer
Only tasted a lambic once, thought it was vile...

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 17:50
by StevieDS
mark1964 wrote:there is a faster way of making sours ive got one fermenting now that will be ready in 4 weeks


There's a rather beautiful quote written on the wall of the famous Cantillon brewery, known for it's world class sour beers. It roughly translates as:

"Time does not respect what is done without it."

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 17:51
by StevieDS
BarnsleyBrewer wrote:Only tasted a lambic once, thought it was vile...

:o A well made lambic or gueuze is a thing of beauty.

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 05:47
by kev
mark1964 wrote:there is a faster way of making sours ive got one fermenting now that will be ready in 4 weeks


How's that?

K

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 05:55
by mark1964
I do the souring post boil. Which takes about 24 hours then when the wort is soured to taste boil as normal killing the bacteria and ferment at normal temp

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 10:54
by BarnsleyBrewer
StevieDS wrote:
BarnsleyBrewer wrote:Only tasted a lambic once, thought it was vile...

:o A well made lambic or gueuze is a thing of beauty.

Can you recommend one that I could buy from a supermarket that could change my views?

BB

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 11:23
by mark1964
Search for chorlton Brewing in Manchester they have a good range

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 11:27
by StevieDS
Probably not :lol:
I had some incredible lambic, fruit lambic and gueuze in Belgium, Cantillon, Tilquin, 3 Fonteinen, Boon.
But here, certainly in NI anyway, it's difficult to find.
The only ones I can find are Lindemans which imo, are to sour beers what John Smith's is to English ale, so I can understand your dislike :D

Re: Lambic Mk 1

PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 10:51
by kev
mark1964 wrote:I do the souring post boil. Which takes about 24 hours then when the wort is soured to taste boil as normal killing the bacteria and ferment at normal temp


It's boiled twice?

K