Access to a old english apple Orchard.

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Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Cider-Sim » Mon Oct 03, 2016 19:39

While out walking the dog in our village on the lookout for hedge row goodies :whistle: cam across the most fantastic looking orchard full of every type of apple trees you could ever ask for , i know they say for a true country style cider you need equal quantities of cookers, sweet and crab apples , well kerching theres all 3 and i can help myself to as many as i want :mrgreen: :party:

Got my neighbour in on it and he now in the process of ordering a decent size press and straining bags .
Excited is not the word :cheers1:

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby HTH1975 » Mon Oct 03, 2016 21:26

You jammy bugger, ha ha. Good on you.

I've got a village near me where there are about 4-5 mature apple trees available for scrumping. Also loads of crab apples round here. Just need to buy bramleys.

2016: 330L brewed (72 gallons, over 8 firkins)
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Drinking: store-bought beer as my bar is dry
Conditioning: choc-coffee oatmeal wheat stout, various ciders, cherry 'brett' brown ale, imperial Pilsner.
Fermenting: Bock (6.5%), IPA (5.5%), Pale Ale (4.5)
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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby secla » Mon Oct 03, 2016 22:57

My father in law just to over the orchard in the allotment group hes in !
probably 8 large apple trees, some plum and some other fruits aswell ! unfortunately he makes his own cider :(
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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Cider-Sim » Tue Oct 04, 2016 18:25

HTH1975 wrote:You jammy bugger, ha ha. Good on you.

I've got a village near me where there are about 4-5 mature apple trees available for scrumping. Also loads of crab apples round here. Just need to buy bramleys.


:lol: Could not picked it closer to home if i tried , less than 5 mins from the bungalow , got the lot bramleys , dabinett , sweet alfords , morgan sweets , 3 different lots of crab apples and a load of ones no ones knows , so got great variety, got over 70 lbs worth this morning , be rude not to have a fresh made apple pie from our hard labour.... :whistle:
cannot wait to get started... :mrgreen: :cheers1:

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Cider-Sim » Thu Nov 17, 2016 16:39

Should be collecting another load of apples to store for 3/4 weeks so there be prime for pressing , but wanted an oppinion from experienced brewers ,
for a real tradition cider made from fresh apples from the orchard would you use a cider yeast or i see one of the mods say champagne yeast .
What would give the most authentic natural flavour .

Getting excited now :party: :cheers1:

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Buster » Thu Nov 17, 2016 19:02

Cider-Sim wrote:Should be collecting another load of apples to store for 3/4 weeks so there be prime for pressing , but wanted an oppinion from experienced brewers ,
for a real tradition cider made from fresh apples from the orchard would you use a cider yeast or i see one of the mods say champagne yeast .
What would give the most authentic natural flavour .

Getting excited now :party: :cheers1:

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Crastney » Thu Nov 17, 2016 19:39

Cider-Sim wrote:Should be collecting another load of apples to store for 3/4 weeks so there be prime for pressing , but wanted an oppinion from experienced brewers ,
for a real tradition cider made from fresh apples from the orchard would you use a cider yeast or i see one of the mods say champagne yeast .
What would give the most authentic natural flavour .

Getting excited now :party: :cheers1:


Sepends what you like drinking, what style you want, etc.
as with beer, yeast choice is a major factor. Most ciders are made with champagne yeast - personally I use Lalvin EC1118. I don't think there is a specific 'cider' yeast - you could go all natural and use whatever is alive and on the apples in the orchard.
Ale yeasts tend to have a low attenuation, so stop at a higher SG, and give a sweeter cider.
white or red wine yeasts will also work fine, but may have different flavour profiles (I don't know how or what, I've never tried...)

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Cider-Sim » Thu Nov 17, 2016 19:52

Buster wrote:White Labs WLP775 available from Rob @ themaltmiller.co.uk or http://www.brewuk.co.uk

Many thanks for the reply and link , :notworthy: i think i will give this a go :cheers1:

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby HTH1975 » Thu Nov 17, 2016 20:34

I've made a couple of ciders (currently in demijohns) this past month. I've used S-04 and S-05. Both have fermented very dry. From what I gather, apples have simpler sugars that pretty much any yeast will happily munch through. Mine had certainly gone down to 1.002 a week or so ago and it's still bubbling away (slowly mind, but still going nonetheless).

If you use a packaged yeast, remember to add a crushed campden tablet to your apple juice and leave for 24 hours before adding your yeast. This kills off any wild yeast and other nasties.

Alternatively, you can just skip the campden tablets and yeast, then the wild bacteria/yeast on the apples will kick in. From what I've read, you could get a lovely fruity farmhouse cider, or vinegar.

I'd probably put a cheeky 5L into a demijohn to ferment wild yeast, then treat the rest of the cider with packaged yeast and a campden tablet.

2016: 330L brewed (72 gallons, over 8 firkins)
2017: 105L brewed
Drinking: store-bought beer as my bar is dry
Conditioning: choc-coffee oatmeal wheat stout, various ciders, cherry 'brett' brown ale, imperial Pilsner.
Fermenting: Bock (6.5%), IPA (5.5%), Pale Ale (4.5)
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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Buster » Thu Nov 17, 2016 20:36

Cider-Sim wrote:
Buster wrote:White Labs WLP775 available from Rob @ themaltmiller.co.uk or http://www.brewuk.co.uk

Many thanks for the reply and link , :notworthy: i think i will give this a go :cheers1:

Your welcome :hat: you can take a better look here -- >>> http://www.whitelabs.com/yeast-bank/wlp ... ider-yeast :thumb:

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Buster » Thu Nov 17, 2016 20:52

I should also add that if you are using the WLP 775 yeast I would use Camden tablets as described here:- Add 1 to 1.5 crushed Campden tablets per gallon of cider, wait 24 to 36 hours and then add your desired wine yeast. You have killed the wildlife in the natural cider, and then added your own single-strain alcohol-fermenting yeast. Crush the tablets between 2 spoons and dissolve in a small amount of juice and stir in your fermenting bucket. Good luck with it.

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Buster » Thu Nov 17, 2016 21:00

Should you wish to put aside a gallon or 2 of juice I have small quantity of harvested yeast from Henry Westons " Old Rosie Cider " if you would like try some drop me a PM with your address and I will send you enough for a 5 gallon brew.

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Crastney » Fri Nov 18, 2016 13:29

just to clarify - CT do not kill yeast, they just stun them to stop them reproducing. You should also use a stabiliser (Potasium sorbate?) at the same time. here is a thread about the differences.

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Buster » Fri Nov 18, 2016 14:15

Crastney wrote:just to clarify - CT do not kill yeast, they just stun them to stop them reproducing. You should also use a stabiliser (Potasium sorbate?) at the same time. here is a thread about the differences.

Sorry, that is absolutely correct, Camden tablets do not kill wild yeast but they help with oxidation as well.

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Cider-Sim » Fri Nov 18, 2016 21:52

Buster wrote:
Crastney wrote: You should also use a stabiliser (Potasium sorbate?) at the same time.


Bang on the money to the recipe i was going to use , once we have pressed the apples, i have both CT and potassium sorbate so will add accordingly when i get to that stage,
thanks Buster and Crastney for the great advice , :notworthy: i,ll add pics on the day were pulping and pressing and all through the " brew " :party: :cheers1:

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Crastney » Sat Nov 19, 2016 20:28

You're welcome, hope the cider making goes well!

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby jkp » Sun Nov 20, 2016 05:47

Crastney wrote:just to clarify - CT do not kill yeast, they just stun them to stop them reproducing. You should also use a stabiliser (Potasium sorbate?) at the same time. here is a thread about the differences.


re K-sorbate, Are you talking about pre or post fermentation?

I've only ever used it post fermentation to prevent re-fermentation on back sweetening.

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Crastney » Wed Nov 23, 2016 15:28

I usually only use stabiliser (K-sorbate) post fermentation, to ensure yeast are stunned, and effectively killed off, but you can use it on fresh juice, pre fermentation, if you're going to wait a while after that before adding your own yeast. usual practice is that you add CT, and then only leave it 24 hours before adding your own yeast/starter, in which case any natural yeasts still there will be outcompeted by your added yeast. If you have to buy the yeast in, and you're waiting for it to arrive, it's worth adding the stabiliser too, just gives a little more chance that you won't get nasties in the time gap. obviously a lot better to be prepared with the yeast, and you don't need the K-sorbate pre fermentation.

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Buster » Wed Nov 23, 2016 17:04

Crastney wrote:I usually only use stabiliser (K-sorbate) post fermentation, to ensure yeast are stunned, and effectively killed off, but you can use it on fresh juice, pre fermentation, if you're going to wait a while after that before adding your own yeast. usual practice is that you add CT, and then only leave it 24 hours before adding your own yeast/starter, in which case any natural yeasts still there will be outcompeted by your added yeast. If you have to buy the yeast in, and you're waiting for it to arrive, it's worth adding the stabiliser too, just gives a little more chance that you won't get nasties in the time gap. obviously a lot better to be prepared with the yeast, and you don't need the K-sorbate pre fermentation.

Thats exactly what I PM'd to CiderSim ....how weird. :thumb:

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Crastney » Thu Nov 24, 2016 12:44

great minds think alike - obviously

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Cider-Sim » Thu Nov 24, 2016 14:17

Like to give huge shout out to Buster (John) for his generous offer in sending 3 bottles of old rosie yeast starters.
Will return the bottles filled with Nacton scrumpy your. A true gent.
Appreciated.

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Cider-Sim » Mon Nov 28, 2016 14:13

So went over the orchard Friday and collected about a dozen shopping bag full that were all on the ground.
Spent a lot of Saturday washing them and then Sunday pulping and pressing them .

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Finished up with about 8 gallons. And a ph of 3.8 so happy with that as a reading.
Pitched in Busters old rose yeast starters he kindly sent me added some yeast nutrient and pectolase to help improve the taste in the cider and bring out the flavours.

Good amount of crab apples were pressed so added no tannin.

Took a hydrometer reading at start of fermentation 1045 .


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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby HTH1975 » Mon Nov 28, 2016 14:31

Plenty of apples there mate, good work. Are you leaving it to age until spring in the hope of malolactic fermentation?

2016: 330L brewed (72 gallons, over 8 firkins)
2017: 105L brewed
Drinking: store-bought beer as my bar is dry
Conditioning: choc-coffee oatmeal wheat stout, various ciders, cherry 'brett' brown ale, imperial Pilsner.
Fermenting: Bock (6.5%), IPA (5.5%), Pale Ale (4.5)
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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Cider-Sim » Mon Nov 28, 2016 14:59

HTH1975 wrote:Plenty of apples there mate, good work. Are you leaving it to age until spring in the hope of malolactic fermentation?


Will leave it for at least 2 weeks and take a hydrometer reading to see if it has fully femented out, its bubbling nicely at 18 c degrees, so will probably leave it for a slow ferment to help with a better tasting cider. :cheers1:

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Re: Access to a old english apple Orchard.

Postby Buster » Mon Nov 28, 2016 20:40

Cider-Sim wrote:Like to give huge shout out to Buster (John) for his generous offer in sending 3 bottles of old rosie yeast starters.
Will return the bottles filled with Nacton scrumpy your. A true gent.
Appreciated.

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Your are more than welcome, I asked for help a while back on here and was overwhelmed by the generosity of the members on here so I am merely returning the help. This is and always will be a great Forum :hat:

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