The new build has begun.

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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby LeeH » Mon Oct 12, 2015 20:56

Well after a impromptu house move (like you do) I was a bit too busy to continue with the build.

Here's an updated PFD,

The new bargain sink of eBay

And the control panel enclosure.

http://www.pdf-archive.com/2015/10/12/brewery3-1/

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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby LeeH » Mon Oct 12, 2015 21:08

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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby bobsbeer » Mon Oct 12, 2015 21:37

Looking good. :thumb:
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby BarnsleyBrewer » Mon Oct 12, 2015 23:43

Cracking build...

"Brewing Fine Ales in Barnsley Since 1984"
- - - - - - - 30 years (1984 - 2014)- - - - - - -
Pints Brewed in 2017......... 416
Pints brewed in 2016.. 208
Pints brewed in 2015.. 624
Pints brewed in 2014.. 832
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby LeeH » Wed Oct 14, 2015 19:32

Latest PFD and Ive started wiring the control panel. (no pics yet)

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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby bobsbeer » Thu Oct 15, 2015 10:02

Are you using electric valves? My only comment would be to add manual valves on the outlet of the pumps to control the flow rather than use speed controllers, assuming you are using mag pumps which it looks like you are. Are you bottom filling the mash tun? I went with a separate inlet on the mash tun for underlet filling rather than use the outlet. It made it easier for planning the lines and valve configuration. Although I decided against 3 way valves and have all 2 way, but I also use 3 pumps which made it easier to configure the flow. Each vessel has it's own pump on the outlet. The MT pump handles the recirculation and also later pumps to the boiler. The LT pump recirculates the water during heat up to avoid layering and ensure an even temperature then fills the MT and also handles the sparge flow. The boiler pump is used to recirculate through the chiller and then into the FV. Hope that makes sense.
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby LeeH » Thu Oct 15, 2015 10:36

Hi bobsbeer, yes I'm looking at using speed controllers. http://m.rs-online.com/h5/mobile/uk/cat ... 7480832%2F

But I'm gong to trial one at the weekend because I know the pumps speed to flow ratio isn't linear.

Even if that is a success I'll still need a valve on the RIMS to keep it full, I'll ammend the PFD. Thanks for that.

I do underlet, it worked a treat on my old system using gravity but on this I will have to pump. I can throttle the flow on the MT valve. If I add another inlet on this 2 pump system it will make the pipe work more complex so I'll stick with underletting from the outlet unless I change to 3 pumps.

That's a great idea recirculating the HLT, it's a problem I did foresee but thought about just giving it a stir with the wooden mash paddle.

Have you any pics or drawings of yours?

Thanks for the input.

Lee.
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The new build has begun.

Postby LeeH » Thu Oct 15, 2015 10:37

Why did you use 3 way valves? I have only just changed to 3 way to reduce the amount off joints and fittings.

And no, they are all manual. I looked at full automation using a PLC and HMI (touch screen) but it would have doubled the build time and cost even though I have a PLC I could have used.

Last edited by LeeH on Fri Oct 16, 2015 12:28, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby bobsbeer » Thu Oct 15, 2015 19:56

This was my layout. In reality the HLT is above the MT and the boiler is level with the HLT. The diagram doesn't show the manual valves used to throttle the pumps. I omitted the float switches and the pressure sensors for now, as my DX1 unit was dead on arrival and the company have gone out of business so went to plan B, and all the valves are controlled via switches on my panel.

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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby bobsbeer » Thu Oct 15, 2015 20:24

What valves re you using? Can they handle the flow directions you want? I don't have three way valves, but my understanding of them are that they come in two configuration L & T. Image
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby LeeH » Fri Oct 16, 2015 12:34

:thumb: I'm using the T type so I can use them in any configuration.

PFD updated with 2 extra valves. 1 on the RIMS and 1 on the heat exchanger. Thanks :thumb:

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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby LeeH » Fri Oct 16, 2015 14:34

RIMS mounted.

Just waiting for the valves to arrive from China now....could be weeks.

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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby Sorcerers Apprentice » Sun Oct 25, 2015 09:13

Hi just reading through your build, well done it looks super, do you mind if I throw in a suggestion: consider a 1/2" flow switch in line with the RIMs heater. I'm prevented from posting a link to a typical one but there are lots on ebay and Aliexpress
A flow switch like this could control a relay delivering power to the element and stop the heater firing without a flow of wort or water in the case of cleaning. This will prevent damage to the element and also the wort in the event of a blockage eg a blinded false bottom
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby LeeH » Sun Oct 25, 2015 11:54

Super idea thanks, I'll have a look for one. The panel isn't built yet so it's no bother slipping one in.
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby LeeH » Sun Oct 25, 2015 12:02

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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby Sorcerers Apprentice » Mon Oct 26, 2015 01:27

That's it exactly - I've also been considering putting them in line with my chugger pumps, a push button will start the pump and once flow is established you can release the button and the supply will be maintained via the flow switch. But if the flow stops then the pump stops thus preventing the pump from running dry. My only concern is that the flow switch may cause issues in some circumstances eg if the flow is throttled back to prevent compacting the grain bed on the false bottom, the flow rate may not be high enough to activate the switch. There seem to be some flow switches which are adjustable, possibly allowing activation of the switch at lower flow rates
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby cyclops » Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:07

i have one of those and i took it off in the end, its a good plan but you need pressure to open the switch in the first place. The problem i found was i could not prime the pump with it. Its a bit like dipping a straw in water with your finger over the end and you get no water going up the straw.

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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby LeeH » Mon Oct 26, 2015 12:25

I guess it just needs a bleed before the switch then?
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The new build has begun.

Postby LeeH » Mon Oct 26, 2015 16:14

Pipe work is progressing. Image

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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby bobsbeer » Mon Oct 26, 2015 19:36

Looking good. :thumb:
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby Sorcerers Apprentice » Tue Oct 27, 2015 10:01

LeeH wrote:I guess it just needs a bleed before the switch then?

I would have reckoned on installing it on the delivery side of the pump rather than the supply side,
Pump = Ball Valve = Tee Piece with Bleed Valve = Flow Switch ?
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby LeeH » Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:58

Yes I was always gong to put it on the outlet but as suggested it will need a bleed which I think I can do with the existing set up.

I can bleed some through with the drain point.
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby secla » Wed Oct 28, 2015 00:36

may be a silly question, how much wort do you lose sitting in all the pipe work
obviously the pumps need to be flooded so your going to be losing anything in the lines.
Id imagine the amount is probably small in the long run but i hate wasting beer
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby PhatFil » Thu Oct 29, 2015 00:05

Pi R squared times the length of the tube will give you its volume (inside radius..), but not all will represent the dead volume of the pipework, and suitably positioned drain valves should let the last runnings get jugged into their destination..

and elegance comes at a cost ;)
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Re: The new build has begun.

Postby jkp » Thu Oct 29, 2015 03:14

This is a fantastic build!

I don't know anything about plumbing or electronics so I might be totally wrong, but why not put the pumps and valves a little higher? I've been lucky enough to use a Brewmagic on a few occasions which is a similar size system with RIMs etc. and the pipework is all right below the level of the HLT and MT, so all valves are at arms reach.

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